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COVID - How to protect ourselves
#1
I've spent a lot of time researching ways we can help protect ourselves and each other from COVID. I've listed some things I've found below.

I am a solutions orientated person. By that, I try to solve a problem instead of complaining.

Please, NO COMMENTS ABOUT WHY THINGS WON'T WORK. If I, or anyone else, is wrong about a stat or there is a different point of view from a credible resource, please post it here.

I just don't want to hear, "It's a good idea but it won't work because so and so won't do this and that. And please, no politics or politicians.

I also strongly believe that knowledge is power. You may never use any of this, but you know where to find them if/when needed.
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#2
Face masks. This is a topic that really makes me frustrated and mad.

Eastern countries use them, Western don't.

I suggest doing your own research to see which countries wear masks and which don't and their situations concerning COVID.

My issue is the advice given by our medical experts about masks. The Western experts say they can be effective, and they are correct...but then they tell us the issues.
  • One issue is that people without training don't have a proper seal between their mask and face.

  • Another issues is that untrained people cross-contaminate their hands and face when removing the masks.

This is a simply matter of education.


What frustrates me is...

Many of those same experts I've seen say that face masks are effective, despite having a seal and cross-contamination issues, because they help prevent people from touching their faces with their hands.

Also every expert I've seen that says masks are ineffective (except for the reasons above) and commented on the following said that even though they don't protect you very well from being infected THEY DO PROTECT OTHERS FROM BEING INFECTED BY YOU.

Why I'm mad. Let me repeat. Masks prevent you from infecting someone else. The result is the same exact thing. It cuts transmission. A lot.

Don't take my word. Please research this for yourself.

Summary:
  • Masks don't work to protect you when they aren't sealed properly and from cross-contamination with hands.

  • They do work because they protect you from touching your nose and mouth with your hands.

  • They do work from protecting others from you if you're infected.
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#3
Temperature -

Take your temp before going out. If it's over 100F don't go. While a fever does not mean you have COVID and if you don't have a fever it doesn't mean you don't have it, a fever is a pretty good indicator.

Assuming my info about masks above is correct, it seems logical to assume that in public using a mask in public and checking for fever along with excellent hygiene, will greatly decrease the spread of COVID.

Fever Map

Kinsa sells USB thermometers and tracks the temperature of 10 millions (?) Americans for "atypical illness" (fevers that don't seem to fit).

They have been very accurate in the past with predicting where the flu will pop up, much faster and better than the CDC, and it updates in real time. This doesn't mean they can predict were COVID will appear, but I think they should be considered the most accurate until there's evidence they're not.

https://healthweather.us
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#4
What Are The Best Materials for Making DIY Masks?

This article is the best I've found for telling us how effective different household materials are for creating DIY masks for protecting against viruses including those about the same size ad COVID. The research was done by Cambridge U.

https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/best...mask-virus

One important note is that they all (except scarves) blocked at least 50% of the virus. That means they DOUBLE (or more) the chances of NOT getting COVID compared to not wearing a mask, assuming they are put on correctly or any cross contamination with hands.

When talking about viral/exponential growth, this reduction is very significant. And these numbers don't include the person wearing the mask from spreading a virus to others.

Vacuum cleaner bags can be pretty effective. However, they aren't easy to breath through. And the report doesn't include coffee filters or paper towels.

More from Smartfilters:
https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/can-...particles/

This article explains why nano-particles (really small like COVID) actually are easier to catch in a filter than larger particles. Hint: They don't fly in straight lines.

Quote:Just how small is 0.3 microns compared to viruses? The coronavirus measures approximately 0.1 microns in diameter, so 3 times smaller than measured in our test. However, 0.3 microns is an important size to test, because 0.3 micron particles are the most difficult to capture.

The crazy reality is that particles smaller than 0.3 microns are actually easier to capture. Don’t believe us; believe the data. Here’s the science behind it

But if we zoom down to the really small particles—like nanoparticles—things start getting weird. Nanoparticles are so small that they bounce around like a pinball when they hit gas molecules. (Scientists call this Brownian Motion.) That means they fly in random zigzag patterns.
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#5
Coffee Filters Eyed in Mask Shortage
https://spectrumlocalnews.com/nys/centra...k-shortage

Quote:The document was written by Dan Bersak, an engineer who said that he wrote it up as a personal favor for a close friend involved in emergency planning for the state.

“If it was me, and I had nothing else, I would absolutely wear it,” Bersak said in an interview, adding that the mask isn’t approved by a regulatory agency but rather designed “using my gut experience -- my gut instinct as an engineer.”

“That said I would prefer a N95 (mask) for sure. If I couldn’t get a real surgical mask I would get that. This is neither of these things.”



How to make a homemade face mask with coffee filters

This page has a video showing how to make a facemask using coffee filters based on the article just above:
https://www.wwlp.com/news/health/coronav...face-mask/
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#6
Mail. I may be too cautious, but I think there is a possibility that the mailman may deliver infected mail which may infect us. I believe the virus can stay alive up to 4 hours on cardboard.

For the past two days I was at my mailbox when the mail was delivered by the mailman. On the first day the mailman was wearing surgical gloves and on the second he was NOT wearing gloves. I asked him why he was NOT wearing gloves as I was spraying the mail with the H2O2 recipe.

He said he forgot and quickly put a pair of gloves on. I told him that the gloves were meant to protect both him and us meaning the public from the virus. He nodded and politely asked me not to say anything.

This morning we went grocery shopping and arrived at Walmart 40 minutes after they opened. There about 120 people ahead of us standing in line to go inside. There were two security guards controlling the line. They were admitting 10 people at a time every 2 minutes.

I noticed people coming out of the store were placing their empty buggies in the buggy place (you know) and some people just arriving were taking the buggies out of the buggy place and getting in line. My thought was maybe they might be out of buggies inside the store. So I went to get a buggy and sprayed it with the H2O2 solution. As I was spraying it a security guard stopped me and asked me what I was doing. Explained it to him. He radioed somebody, got the word, and told me thank you as he walked away.

At the cash register I sprayed the solution on the groceries after the clerk touched them. I bagged them. The clerk just looked at and rolled her eyes.

Again, I may be too cautious and my wife said as much, but I told her it was a good thing that she didn't marry me for my brains. lol.
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#7
Prevention is better than cure... Clicked the coffee link from Kurt - Had pop up denying me entry to site Smile
"Our European visitors are important to us. This site is currently unavailable to visitors from the European Economic Area while we work to ensure your data is protected in accordance with applicable EU laws." So just laughed out loud...We are even banned from reading what could help us Smile Smile

Seriously though thank you for this thread, we are already in isolation but people think its all a joke. I did some calculations as I read some stuff from Peak Prosperity. I do hope he is wrong on those figures but it seems exponential growth has no master. (At least in an Earthly way, "as for me & my House my trust is in the Lord Almighty")
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#8
(03-22-2020, 04:18 PM)cosmic77 Wrote: Prevention is better than cure... Clicked the coffee link from Kurt - Had pop up denying me entry to site Smile
"Our European visitors are important to us. This site is currently unavailable to visitors from the European Economic Area while we work to ensure your data is protected in accordance with applicable EU laws." So just laughed out loud...We are even banned from reading what could help us Smile Smile

Seriously though thank you for this thread, we are already in isolation but people think its all a joke. I did some calculations as I read some stuff from Peak Prosperity. I do hope he is wrong on those figures but it seems exponential growth has no master. (At least in an Earthly way, "as for me & my House my trust is in the Lord Almighty")

Which link? I'll post the relevant info here.
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#9
(03-22-2020, 02:09 PM)Jeffery Wrote: Mail. I may be too cautious, but I think there is a possibility that the mailman may deliver infected mail which may infect us. I believe the virus can stay alive up to 4 hours on cardboard.

For the past two days I was at my mailbox when the mail was delivered by the mailman. On the first day the mailman was wearing surgical gloves and on the second he was NOT wearing gloves. I asked him why  he was NOT wearing gloves as I was spraying the mail with the H2O2 recipe.

He said he forgot and quickly put a pair of gloves on. I told him that the gloves were meant to protect both him and us meaning the public from the virus. He nodded and politely asked me not to say anything.

This morning we went grocery shopping and arrived at Walmart 40 minutes after they opened. There about 120 people ahead of us standing in line to go inside. There were two security guards controlling the line. They were admitting 10 people at a time every 2 minutes.

I noticed people coming out of the store were placing their empty buggies in the buggy place (you know) and some people just arriving were taking the buggies out of the buggy place and getting in line. My thought was maybe they might be out of buggies inside the store. So I went to get a buggy and sprayed it with the H2O2 solution. As I was spraying it a security guard stopped me and asked me what I was doing. Explained it to him. He radioed somebody, got the word, and told me thank you as he walked away.

At the cash register I sprayed the solution on the groceries after the clerk touched them. I bagged them. The clerk just looked at and rolled her eyes.

Again, I may be too cautious and my wife said as much, but I told her it was a good thing that she didn't marry me for my brains. lol.

I sprayed mine with H2O2 when I got home.

Risk vs Gain

Risk = 20 cents worth H2O2. A little public embarrassment.

Gain = Potentially saving lives and health. Safe with no environmental risk since H2O2 breaks down into H2O and oxegen.

I say keep spraying.

BTW...did the postman wash his hands before touching the gloves and after taking them off?
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#10
I asked a (Aussie) nurse friend how they are trained about putting on and taking off masks to avoid cross contamination. She said they are taught to wash hands:

Before putting a mask on

Before taking a mask off

After taking a mask off
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#11
Thanks Kurt - Its OK I used a VPN to see behind it (HMA)
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#12
(03-22-2020, 07:09 PM)Kurt Wrote: [quote pid='722' dateline='1584886177']
<snip>

I sprayed mine with H2O2 when I got home.

Risk vs Gain

Risk = 20 cents worth H2O2. A little public embarrassment.

Gain = Potentially saving lives and health. Safe with no environmental risk since H2O2 breaks down into H2O and oxegen.

I say keep spraying.

BTW...did the postman wash his hands before touching the gloves and after taking them off?
[/quote]
No, but I was out there today and somebody new took his place and he had gloves and a mask. I asked if the other mailman was okay and he said today is his day off.

BTW, my wife said she noticed two guys outside Walmart spraying the buggies before they were pushed inside the store. And I noticed a big "We are hiring" sign outside the entrance. Also, there were signs in every isle that said "One item per customer." When we were standing in line to pay a mom with three kids and two cases of water asked my wife if she would buy a case of water for her (cash in hand). I put the water on my buggy and told he to put her money away. Outside the store I placed the water in her buggy and she almost cried.
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#13
Jeffrey - Thats so wonderful to help her... Its 5.30am right now & you just started my day off just right. Lets all take this example.
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#14
Some random thoughts:

It seems COVID is sensitive to heat. Not "summer" heat but temps of 140-170 f was the range I found. Boiling water is 212 f at sea level. I live 8500 above sea level it it boils at about 190 up here. Microwaves are not recommended because they don't heat evenly and pockets of virus may survive. If you ever have to wear a mask (see above) you may want to boil it if the material allows it instead of using chemicals since you'll be breathing through it.

Social distancing - Why not go to 24 hours for places like grocery stores so people are more spread out over time with dedicated time time slots based on some factor? Distance shouldn't only measured in feet, it should also be measured in time. Only allow curbside pickup so workers can stay safer and only they need to wear protective equipment. We have drive-by testing and we need drive-by grocery pickup. Assist people that may not have the ability to order online.

I can't remember where, but one town is having people put up green pieces of paper in the windows of their homes. If it changes to red they need help of some kind.
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#15
Our local Walmart has scheduled shopping for seniors only on Tuesdays. The Walmart used to be open 24/7 before the virus and now it is open to the public 12 hours a day. The remaining 12 hours are reserved for stocking and because of a lack of employees to open 24/7.

Walmart increased their on-hand inventory of electric scooters for the handicapped and seniors.

Customers can go online, pay for groceries and pickup or have them delivered. The Walmart guy said that worked well before the virus, except now there are not enough employees to do the in-store bundling of the groceries and not enough employees to staff the pickup area.

Oh, some of my info is what was put out at a City Hall meeting. Owed to the virus I won't be attending anymore meetings. All online in the future.

I noticed a few families that usually have only one buggy now have two or more, so they can get around the one like-item per customer.
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#16
(03-23-2020, 11:48 AM)Jeffery Wrote: Our local Walmart has scheduled shopping for seniors only on Tuesdays. The Walmart used to be open 24/7 before the virus and now it is open to the public 12 hours a day. The remaining 12 hours are reserved for stocking and because of a lack of employees to open 24/7.

Walmart increased their on-hand inventory of electric scooters for the handicapped and seniors.

Customers can go online, pay for groceries and pickup or have them delivered. The Walmart guy said that worked well before the virus, except now there are not enough employees to do the in-store bundling of the groceries and not enough employees to staff the pickup area.

Oh, some of my info is what was put out at a City Hall meeting. Owed to the virus I won't be attending anymore meetings. All online in the future.

I noticed a few families that usually have only one buggy now have two or more, so they can get around the one like-item per customer.

My nearest Walmart is a one hour drive away. And all Walmarts and essential businesses should still be open 24 hours. If all supplies were delivered curbside, no one would have to go inside except the employees making everyone safer. They can still stock whenever they want...but it's a waste of time. Just fill orders directly from stock. The displays don't have to look pretty or the shelves be full. That's a lot of wasted people power.

Rotate the scheduling. For example, by first letter of license plate or last name or drivers license. People don't have to go to work. They can set an alarm and go get their groceries between 2 and 5 am and then go back to bed. If they can't do that, wait a day or two and they can go between 9 am and noon.

These are just examples and need more thought, but the concept is sound. Supplies are not they only thing that may be considered essential. So are the workers who make it possible to get the essential supplies.
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#17
This article explains why we should all be wearing masks when in public:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2...Engb83-VW8

An important part of this articles is this:
Quote:"My data-focused research institute, fast.ai, has found 34 scientific papers indicating basic masks can be effective in reducing virus transmission in public — and not a single paper that shows clear evidence that they cannot."
 
Here's a page that lists his resources:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HLrm...sn77t4huar

This video shows how to make a face mask using a vacuum cleaner hepa filter:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6d3twpHwis


Previously I did some research into whether hepa filters would work. Even though COVID is technically smaller that the hepa filters, it seems COVID is a "nano particle" which means it doesn't "fly" smoothly and bounces around. https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/can-...oparticles

Here's how to create a mask using a tee shirt:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJaVBt8q6g8

When creating a mask, the nose bridge is essential and I'd add it to the tee shirt idea above. I've seen paper clips, pipe cleaners and even foil folded a few times taped to the masks so they will grip the brodge of your nose better.
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#18
I thought I posted this before...I'd rather post it twice if than not at all.

This is a study from Cambridge U showing which common household materials are best for making face masks. They chose a cotton blend as best because of the breathability.What Are The Best Materials for Making DIY Masks?
[Image: Mask-Materials-Effectiveness-0.02-Micron...68x592.jpg]
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#19
I did a little experiment with dust masks. I put one on my face "normally" and breathed with my glasses on. My glasses fogged up, indicating a leaky seal around my nose.

I then pinched the little metal strip on the mask around my nose and tested again. This helped a lot, but there was still a little fog on my glasses.

Then I rolled up a 2-3 inch piece of duct tape like a straw with the sticky side out and added it to the mask where the metal tab did and pressed the metal strip and duct tape. That was a really good seal.

Since sealing and hygiene/cross-contamination seem to be the biggest issues with masks I suggest doing a few experiments yourself and consider duct tape for sealing any leaks. Duct tape is called "duct tape" because it was made to seal air ducts air tight. Grab a small mirror and with a mask on hold the mirror around the mask to check for leaks and seal any with some duct tape.

I'm not sure about the material, but a big difference between dust masks you get at the hardware store and surgical masks in that dust masks only have one elastic strap and surgical masks have two. I think it's probably a good idea to check out the differences and to add another strap to better duplicate surgical masks.
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#20
I just saw this and it backs up my experiment above to a degree:

[Image: 02d9cc47.gif?fbclid=IwAR1EDGgEToMLDIFedY...qQxDQSISrk]
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#21
This is really important. Please watch and share.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsKfvETXDvg

I protect you. You protect me.

#masks4all
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#22
https://www.facebook.com/LeonBriePersona...336083171/
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#23
Don't think masks are effective? Read the facts:
https://www.maskssavelives.org/

[Image: Adjustments.plist.jpg]
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#24
(04-04-2020, 12:40 AM)Kurt Wrote: Don't think masks are effective? Read the facts:
https://www.maskssavelives.org/

[Image: Adjustments.plist.jpg]

I am a proponent of wearing masks and have been ever since I came down with severe health issues involving my lungs a couple of years ago. 

I have argued with people, almost lost friendships, worried to no end, etc. to get masks. I wear them whenever I go out. I stand in line every week to buy our family's allotment. 

However, the chart is skewed. Mainland China, like other Asian countries, is a strong mask wearing culture. This is a huge flaw in what is a well intentioned message.
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#25
(04-04-2020, 07:59 AM)10x Wrote:
(04-04-2020, 12:40 AM)Kurt Wrote: Don't think masks are effective? Read the facts:
https://www.maskssavelives.org/

[Image: Adjustments.plist.jpg]





I am a proponent of wearing masks and have been ever since I came down with severe health issues involving my lungs a couple of years ago. 

I have argued with people, almost lost friendships, worried to no end, etc. to get masks. I wear them whenever I go out. I stand in line every week to buy our family's allotment. 

However, the chart is skewed. Mainland China, like other Asian countries, is a strong mask wearing culture. This is a huge flaw in what is a well intentioned message.




Because of not being a trusted source of accurate info, I take China out of any reported statistical analysis. Even if we do consider China as an outlier and include their numbers in the mask to non-mask comparison, the averages of the mask wearing countries would still be much lower than the other countries. It's undeniable that Asian countries have down a better job at containing COVID than Western countries.

And the chart is supported by all the other stats I've posted above concerning masks and isn't the only evidence presented. If masks help, then we should assume that countries where everyone wears them should have lower COVID numbers than countries that don't.

The chart supports this theory, especially considering the chart isn't drawn to scale and the low numbers are MUCH lower when compared to the higher numbers than the chart seems to show. Redraw the map to scale and the chart would be even more dramatic. Compare Italy and Japan. Italy reported 50X the number of cases Japan has. The chart doesn't show that very well.

While China is in the "non mask" group, there are ZERO non-mask countries in the lower numbers of COVID. Don't just look at China, but why are there NO non-mask wearing countries in the counties with lower case numbers?
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#26
[Image: 90969852_10220396498854843_2992596631892...e=5EB32F4D]
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#27
(04-08-2020, 05:07 AM)Kurt Wrote:
[Image: 90969852_10220396498854843_2992596631892...e=5EB32F4D]

That would keep the back of the ears from wearing down/hurting which is a real problem for those not used to wearing them.
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#28
(04-08-2020, 05:13 AM)10x Wrote: That would keep the back of the ears from wearing down/hurting which is a real problem for those not used to wearing them.

I must have weak ears. I was messing around with some masks and elastic and my ears kept bending and couldn't keep the elastic to stay in place because of it. Anyone know any good ear exercises?

Seriously, I finally decided that I need the elastic to wrap all the way around my head...the paper clip looks like it may work too.
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#29
that paper clip thing is a good idea can i download that pic for facebook by any chance? I already have seen posts
where the nurses are saying my ears hurt.

If not thats ok.  

That one video
where the sneeze came out with and without a mask really shook me up.  All you
need is a droplet to get it.  So a mask won't help too much.  I'm not saying forget masks because of that.  But
it was really a shocker to me
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#30
'It's not fancy, but it works': Mississippi doctor uses garden hose, lamp timer and electronic valve to create makeshift ventilators

for less than $100
Quote:Excerpt..

Dr. Charles Robertson, a UMMC pediatric anesthesiologist and the mastermind behind the idea, said he set out to make the "absolute simplest ventilator we can build with parts available in any city, you don't need special tools to put together and can be done quickly as the need arises."

Made with "primarily a garden hose, a lamp timer and electronic valve," the ventilator, named the Robertson Ventilator, for less than $100, can be assembled in approximately 20 to 30 minutes, meaning a dedicated team of four to five could produce nearly 100 in a day if needed, he said.

Demonstrating the functionality of the machine at a news conference Tuesday afternoon, Robertson turned on a ventilator hooked up to a mannequin. The mannequin's chest began to rise and fall.

The Robertson Ventilator: 'The brain behind the thing is actually a lamp timer.

There is a video available, but I could not get the URL.

If this is legit and it seems it is..

it could be a game changer.
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#31
(04-08-2020, 05:00 PM)Claire Koch Wrote: that paper clip thing is a good idea can i download that pic for facebook by any chance? I already have seen posts
where the nurses are saying my ears hurt.

If not thats ok.  

That one video
where the sneeze came out with and without a mask really shook me up.  All you
need is a droplet to get it.  So a mask won't help too much.  I'm not saying forget masks because of that.  But
it was really a shocker to me




Please share anything on this thread you want. It may be on my own FB timeline. Or just right click, copy the image location and paste it on your FB timeline.
Code:
https://scontent-den4-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/90969852_10220396498854843_2992596631892787200_n.jpg?_nc_cat=1&_nc_sid=110474&_nc_ohc=gilPM3wk5pYAX_m99W_&_nc_ht=scontent-den4-1.xx&oh=013ec0a78ecbb7c8cc38c6e0ac4b213f&oe=5EB32F4D
I think it shows that masks work well, but aren't perfect especially around the nose. The cloud of mist is about 1/4 the size with the mask compared to without. But take a really close look and you'll see little drops spraying out at a distance in the unmasked version. Don't look at the "cloud", instead look at the droplets a foot or two away from his face. I tried to enlarge this version to make them easier to see...

  
[Image: 02d9cc47.gif?fbclid=IwAR1EDGgEToMLDIFedY...qQxDQSISrk]
 
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#32
Regarding the mask/nose issue, the masks we use in Asia (not sure about US since I've never worn one there) have a band across the top of the mask. You are supposed to bend that band to fit closer around your nose. 

I was wearing them all wrong. I kept complaining to my wife that when using a mask outside and having to wear my reading glasses, like at church, the glasses would always fog up. When I started bending that band, the problem cleared up almost completely.
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#33
(04-08-2020, 10:16 PM)10x Wrote: Regarding the mask/nose issue, the masks we use in Asia (not sure about US since I've never worn one there) have a band across the top of the mask. You are supposed to bend that band to fit closer around your nose. 

I was wearing them all wrong. I kept complaining to my wife that when using a mask outside and having to wear my reading glasses, like at church, the glasses would always fog up. When I started bending that band, the problem cleared up almost completely.

See post #19 of mine above.

In my non-expert opinion I think the biggest design flaw in the DIY masks is not having the little metal strip that forms and seals around the bridge of the nose. My experiments back this up, as does your experience, the gif above with the mist clouds and my research that says a big issue with masks is people don't seal them correctly.

There's 3 things (probably more) that you can use to make the metal seal strip:
pipe cleaner
a straightened paper clip
folded/rolled foil

Then use some duct tape to tape it in place.

The image below shows the little metal strip that you're supposed to bend around your nose to fit...and I believe it's a big deal:
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#34
   
This popped up on my FB feed the other day. It was an advertisement by a company that creates masks so I'm not sure if it's legit or self-serving.
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#35
I know a few people that make their own masks and use pipe cleaners as seals.
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#36
I had to go to the post office today. It was my first time out in weeks. All customers were wearing masks or some type of face covering including me.

It was amazing how many times I caught myself making mistakes. First, I put my hand on the counter where the pens and forms are to lean while I was standing in line. Then when I got up to the window where the clerk is, I sat my keys on that counter. I took my squirt bottle of h2o2 so I did a quick spray as soon as I got back to the car...but still.

When I got home I put my mask in the oven at 210 f for 30 minutes, more than enough to kill COVID. My mask is disposable but I added my own elastic to make it tighter and wanted to reuse the elastic. It seems the metal strip uses some type of heat gun glue because the strip fell off from the heat. Not a big deal because I'm throwing it away anyway but wanted to disinfect it before removing my own elastic.

I do caution people from using heat on things to kill COVID. As we know, heat makes things expand. This includes the spaces between things, which is why heating a jar lid or nut and bolt helps loosen them. I'm concerned that heat may increase the size of the holes in masks and don't know if they will shrink when they cool. However, in my exact situation where I am only concerned with the elastic strap it should be good. Something to think about.
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